Alfons Robert Kleindienst was born in Washington, D.C in March 1930. His father, Alfons Georg Kleindienst [Annotator's Note: Konsulatsekretär I. Klasse, or, Consulate Secretary First Class, Alfons George Kleindienst], was a German diplomat who had originally come to the United States in 1927 when he was posted to the German embassy in Washington, D.C. In 1928 he was transferred from Washington D.C. to New York [Annotator's Note: New York, New York]. While there he sent for his fiancée who was still in Germany. Kleindienst's mother, Mathilde Karoline Haugg, came to the United States and the couple was married the same year. He was later returned to Washington, D.C then, in 1932, he was transferred to Chicago [Annotator's Note: Chicago, Illinois] where the family remained until late 1941. Kleindienst had one younger brother. Kleindienst's aunt and uncle who lived in Chicago owned and operated a bakery. He also had a female cousin live with them for three years so she could learn how to run a household from his mother. Growing up in America was fun for Kleindienst but in a way it was like living in two worlds. At school he learned to read, write, and speak English. When he was at home, he spoke only German or he would not get his 25 cents per week allowance. Additionally, his parents ran the house as if it were in Europe. Even so, Kleindienst went to grammar school, was a Cub Scout [Annotator's Note: part of the Boy Scouts of America youth organization] in Pack 3834 and played with his friends. He was a typical American kid and really liked living in America. He enjoyed going to the movies and buying candy. He got in trouble one time, riding his bike to the candy store when his father told him not to. He said he had the worst paddling he could remember. His father enjoyed traveling, and the visited many places in America.

Alfons Robert Kleindienst had an uncle who was a Boy Scout [Annotator's Note: Boy Scouts of America youth organization] leader. His uncle's neighbors had reported him because he was wearing a brown shirt that looked like a Nazi shirt. His uncle had to go to Washington, D.C. and explain to the court that he was not a Nazi sympathizer. Kleindienst remarked that even though his uncle had three sons in the United States military, some of his neighbors were cruel to him. [Annotator's Note: The interviewer pauses the interview to adjust the microphone at 0:20:20.000.] Kleindienst does not recall feeling any animosity from Americans while he was living in the United States. He was a member of the Boy Scouts as a kid but when he moved to Germany with his parents, he joined the Nazi Youth groups. He does not recall feeling any animosity from the German kids about being from Chicago [Annotator's Note: Chicago, Illinois]. All his German friends wanted to know what the American gangsters were like. His father, a German Diplomat, was sent to Paris [Annotator's Note: Paris, France], so Kleindienst and his family moved with his father into a nice home with some servants. Kleindienst would walk to nearby stores to get bread, milk, and flowers for his mom. He took the metro to school. When they heard the Allies were coming into the city, Kleindienst, along with hundreds of other kids were sent to Bavaria [Annotator's Note: Bavaria, Germany]. There they were supervised by two Nazi men. Kleindienst remarks that these men were very smart and ran the operation very smoothly. They questioned Kleindienst on America. Kleindienst reflects that the German people loved America. Many German people had relatives that lived in America. He believed Hitler [Annotator's Note: German dictator Adolf Hitler] made a mistake by going to war with America. Kleindienst's father worked as an administrator in Munich [Annotator's Note: Munich, Germany] during World War 2. Hitler came in, but Kleindienst's father told him that he needed to apply for a visa because his German visa expired. Hitler asked for his supervisor, and Kleindienst's father was relieved that his supervisor had to deal with him. Kleindienst's father was not fond of Hitler. After the war, Kleindienst made plans with the American consulate to return to the United States. Kleindienst arrived in the United States after 1946 and resided in Highland Park [Annotator's Note: Highland Park, Illinois] with his uncle. Kleindienst worked at a bakery and used all the money he earned to send packages of food and dry goods to his parents in Germany because they did not have many provisions after the war.

Alfons Robert Kleindienst's father [Annotator's Note: Alfons Georg Kleindienst], a German diplomat, did not approve of what Germany was doing by invading countries. Living in America, Kleindienst's father knew what the United States could do if they went to war with Germany. His father had been in the infantry in World War 1. Kleindienst does not recall his father talking to much about the prospect of war with him. He knew his father did not like where Germany was going, but he did not give him his opinion when Germany declared war on America. Soon after World War 2 began, the Kleindienst's were rounded up with other foreign diplomats and sent to the Greenbrier Hotel in West Virginia [Annotator's Note: near White Sulphur Springs, Greenbrier County, West Virginia]. The United States Government had leased the hotel and was using it to temporarily house German, Italian, and Japanese diplomats until they could be returned to their home country. At the hotel, the FBI [Annotator's Note: Federal Bureau of Investigation] was present, and let it be known that they were there. Kleindienst's family enjoyed staying there because they had a swimming pool, tennis courts, and movie theater. They had delicious food and wonderful service. In the basement of the hotel, there were stores where they bought a variety of goods to bring back to Germany. When his family was sent to Europe, Kleindienst was sitting in the dining train cart with his parents. He asked his parents where the butter was for his bread. His parents told him that he will soon learn that Europe will be extremely different than America. Kleindienst soon learned what the meant. After the war, his family settled in the New Orleans Metro area [Annotator's Note: New Orleans, Louisiana] and he eventually opened a bakery in Metairie [Annotator's Note: Metairie, Louisiana]. He married and had six children who helped them in the bakery. He and his family traveled around the United States. Kleindienst collected beer steins during his lifetime.

Alfons Robert Kleindienst and his family moved to Germany after World War 2 began [Annotator's Note: his father, Alfons Georg Kleindienst, was a German diplomat living in the United States until Germany declared war on America.] His father went to Berlin [Annotator's Note: Berlin, Germany] while he and the rest of his family lived with his grandfather in Munich [Annotator's Note: Munich, Germany]. Kleindienst enjoyed the Bavarian culture and food. His mother was a talented clothes maker. While living in Europe as a youth, he was part of the Hitler Youth Program [Annotator's Note: Hitlerjugend, youth organization of the Nazi Party for young men]. He remembered how the program was very organized. They had everything they needed, including uniforms. As a Hitler Youth member, he met the leader of the program, Artur Axmann [Annotator's Note: Artur Axmann, Nazi leader of Hitlerjugend, or, Hitler Youth]. Kleindienst recalls that he had to shake Axmann's left hand when he greeted him because Axmann had lost his right-hand during war [Annotator's Note: on the Eastern Front in 1941]. Kleindienst was sent to a German boy's school so he could learn to read and write in German. After about six months, his parents moved to Paris [Annotator's Note: Paris, France]. Kleindienst joined his parents and continued his education in German and French. He had some difficulty learning French, but German came easier for him. Later he and his brother were sent to a school in the Black Forest [Annotator's Note: in Bavaria, Germany]. When their father came to pick them up near the end of the war, they could hear canons going off nearby [Annotator's Note: Video Break at 1:00:21.000]. Kleindienst did not have trouble finding peers when he moved to Europe. All his German friends were interested in his life in America and wanted to know about the gangsters in Chicago [Annotator's Note: Chicago, Illinois] and Native Americans. Kleindienst always had a loyalty to America because he grew up in the United States.

Alfons Robert Kleindienst and his family moved to Germany after World War 2 began [Annotator's Note: his father, Alfons Georg Kleindienst, was a German diplomat living in the United States until Germany declared war on America]. He remembered experiencing air raids while he was living in Germany. He saw that the allies were trying to bomb the railroad nearby. He recalled hiding in the basement while he was in Munich [Annotator's Note: Munich, Germany]. His father and grandfather had a near death experience with a bombing. One bomb dropped very close to them, but it was a dud. While he was living in Paris [Annotator's Note: Paris, France], he feared the underground resistance the most because they would just come up behind Germans and kill them. Anytime their family knew there might be some serious fighting in the city, they would escape into the mountains for a while. One time they found a dead SS [Annotator's Note: Schutzstaffel; German paramilitary organization] soldier. That was the first time he saw a dead soldier. Shortly after the war, his father decided to move his family to a farm in Bavaria [Annotator's Note: Bavaria, Germany]. Kleindienst had to ride his bike keeping up with the truck that his father was on. He was so scared at one point when a couple of men tried to take his bicycle. He screamed for help and said he was an American. This made the men runaway. He remarked there was no law and order at this point in time, so he was scared that he was going to get killed at any moment. While staying in Paris [Annotator's Note: Paris, France], he was part of the Hitler Youth program [Annotator's Note: Hitlerjugend, youth organization of the Nazi Party for young men] and was sent to camp for training. He learned marching, signing, map reading, and firearms.

Alfons Robert Kleindienst and his family moved to Germany after World War 2 began [Annotator's Note: his father, Alfons Georg Kleindienst, was a German diplomat living in the United States until Germany declared war on America]. His father worked for the embassy in Berlin [Annotator's Note: Berlin, Germany]. In 1943, his father was transferred to Paris [Annotator's Note: Paris, France], so Kleindienst and his family moved with him. Kleindienst enjoyed living in Paris because they lived in a nice apartment and the food was good. [Annotator's Note: Kleindienst goes off subject about a postwar family trip to Europe from 1:19:00.000 to 1:22:04.000.] While he was living in Paris, his parents told him to be careful because it was dangerous being out in the public. He always wore a jacket over his Hitler Youth [Annotator's Note: Hitlerjugend, youth organization of the Nazi Party for young men] uniform so the French Resistance would not come after him. When he was with his mother in public, they would speak American so no one would suspect they were German. Kleindienst carried a green diplomatic passport, so he was able to get into a lot of places without any problems. Kleindienst recalled that being part of the Hitler Youth program, helped him feel like he was part of the German people. He was given several responsibilities, especially dispersing chocolate to the children during Christmas. Towards the end of World War 2, Kleindienst and his family had to be careful about where they went and who they talked to because the Gestapo [Annotator's Note: German Geheime Staatspolizei or Secret State Police; abbreviated Gestapo] would stop people and shoot them on the spot if they did not have the correct papers. In April 1945, the Americans took over the town they were in, and they were told to stay in their room. They did not have to evacuate because they were technically Americans. Kleindienst enjoyed having the American troops below him because the soldiers gave them candy. After the Army unit left the town, one of the soldiers left his weapon. A few days later he returned looking for it. He was so relieved when he found his weapon where he left it.

After the American troops left the Bavarian [Annotator's Note: Bavaria, Germany] town Alfons Kleindienst and his family were residing in, they were required to register and get an identification card. His family had a farm in Bavaria, so they moved there after World War 2. He learned how to milk cows, clean animal stalls, and plow. Being in Europe during World War 2 was not fun because there was always the threat of bombing and fear of being killed by the French Resistance. While he was in the Hitler Youth [Annotator's Note: Hitlerjugend, youth organization of the Nazi Party for young men] program, he had to do physical tests, liking running, jumping, and swimming. Kleindienst was impressed how organized the Hitler Youth program was. He remarked that people had to be very careful who they talked to and what they talked about because neighbors were known to report on each other. Kleindienst also stated that he was never told where the Germans were taking the Jewish people. He was told that they were being resettled. Kleindienst learned about the concentration camps after the war and was stunned to see the pictures. His uncle was in the local police force when the war ended. The Americans made him, and other police officer go into Hitler's [Annotator's Note: German dictator Adolf Hitler] summer home to remove all the Nazi emblems. Eventually, Kleindienst was able to start school again. His father began working with as an interpreter with the Americans. During that time, Kleindienst and his family lived with a Jewish lady. They had very little to eat and used to pick the apples from her apple tree. Kleindienst father eventually was replaced in the Foreign Service and moved back to America.

Alfons Robert Kleindienst would often send canned food and other items to his parents in Germany because they had a difficult time finding enough food. Kleindienst's grandfather was a woodcarver and carved beautiful canes for his family. In 1952, Kleindienst was sent to fight in the Korean War [Annotator's Note: Korean War, 1950 to 1953] and was able to visit Japan on a couple of occasions. He was able to meet with the German Ambassador in Japan because Kleindienst's father knew him well. After his service in the Korean War, Kleindienst wanted to follow in his family's footsteps and own a bakery. He went to school and trained under a master baker in New Orleans [Annotator's Note: New Orleans, Louisiana]. He parents eventually came to the United States in Spring 1952. After his service, Kleindienst reunited with his family in New Orleans. It had been seven years since he last saw his father, mother, and brother. Kleindienst's father did not care for Hitler [Annotator's Note: German dictator Adolf Hitler] but was part of the Nazi Party because by German law he was required to be in it if he worked for the government. Kleindienst never saw his father wear the Nazi badge. When he came over to America, his father passed the De-Nazification test with flying colors because he did not agree with the ideals of the party. He also was a very religious man, and he knew that Hitler punished many Catholics. Kleindienst father was a very well-liked person and fit well in New Orleans. Kleindienst lost three uncles between World War 1 and World War 2. His other uncles moved to the United States and prospered. Kleindienst had prospered and his family has been successful living in America.

While Alfons Robert Kleindienst lived in Munich [Annotator's Note: Munich, Germany] during World War 2, he had no idea that the concentration camps were extermination camps. He knew that the Nazi party was sending all kinds of people to the camps, but that was the extent of it. He knew that there was a factory where prisoners were making dolls nearby. Kleindienst's most memorable experience is watching planes dropping bombs on a nearby railroad. He also has fond memories of living in Paris [Annotator's Note: Paris, France]. The food was good. Kleindienst's mother, out of fear, burned his old Hitler Youth [Annotator's Note: Hitlerjugend, youth organization of the Nazi Party for young men] uniforms and identification after the war. She was afraid if those items were discovered, Kleindienst could be in some serious trouble. Kleindienst remarks that Hitler [Annotator's Note: German dictator Adolf Hitler] would have been considered the greatest leader in Germany if he had not pursued so much power in the end. Hitler had brought work and prosperity to so many Germans prior to World War 2. [Annotator's Note: The interviewer shares a story from 2:32:17.000 to 2:33:51.000.] Once Kleindienst and his mother had to take a train across Germany. The railroad had been bombed, so they had to get on another route. Kleindienst eventually worked out a deal with a German soldier and he and his mother were able to successfully get on a new route. World War 2 changed his life because Kleindienst believes that he would have gone to college and pursued another career besides baking. [Annotator's Note: Kleindienst asks to pause the interview at 2:38:20.000.] Being a baker was hard work and long hours. [Annotator's Note: The interviewer and Kleindienst get off topic at 2:41:15.000.] Kleindienst believes it is a very good idea to have institutions like The National WWII Museum [Annotator's Note: in New Orleans, Louisiana] and to continue to teach about the war to future generations. He believes that there are so many immigrants that want to come to America because of the Constitution, and America needs to keep it that way. He loves the United States and it proud to be an American.

Alfons Robert Kleindienst returned to America by himself after World War 2 from Munich [Annotator's Note: Munich, Germany]. His parents had to remain in Germany because they were German, but Kleindienst was an American. He was so happy to return to America and looked forward to the variety of food that would be available to him again. He lived with his uncle in Highland Park [Annotator's Note: Highland Park, Illinois] where he learned the baking trade. He had several family members in the bakery business. A few years later, Kleindienst was drafted into military service for the Korean War [Annotator's Note: Korean War, 1950 to 1953]. He was sent to Fort Lee, Virginia for Quartermaster School for 16 weeks of basic and advanced training. He became a supply record specialist. He was sent overseas to Japan and then Korea. Kleindienst eventually supervised the supply room. He supplied all of Korea with engineer products and was considered direct support for the front line. He kept his same status as Private First Class because there was a freeze on promotions at the time. [Annotator's Note: There is a video break at 2:00:55.000.] Kleindienst also worked in the bakery during his service in Korea, which he enjoyed very much. After he returned from the Korean War, he moved to New Orleans [Annotator's Note: New Orleans, Louisiana] where his parents were living. His father was able to return to America as a German Consulate.