Avon is 60 miles south of Mitchell, South Dakota. George McGovern spent the first three years of his life in Avon. He then went to Calgary, Canada with his mother because she was of Canadian descent. After his stint in Calgary, he ended up in Mitchell, South Dakota. His education took him through the public school system. He went to Dakota Wesleyan University. After the war, McGovern got his PhD in history from Northwestern University. He was with his wife at the time and the G.I. Bill helped pay for his education. McGovern has high praise for the G.I Bill. The Great Depression, in McGovern's opinion, helped to define people at the time and create a more steadfast resolve. He was a volunteer. He signed up for the Air Force because he wanted to be a pilot. He knew he wanted to be a bomber pilot. He even took a civilian pilot training class that helped to teach him how to fly. He took the flying course in 1941.

George McGovern had never been in an airplane before he took a civilian course. He was scared but eventually got over it and was able to fly a plane. He volunteered at 19 years old. The Air Force at the time did not have much in the way of training planes and useable assets. McGovern and ten of his buddies went into Omaha [Annotator's Note: Omaha, Nebraska] to the recruiting stations. They had the intention of signing up for either the Army Air Corps or the Navy Air Corps. They had to borrow a couple cars from their teachers. A rumor circulated that if one signed up with the Army Air Corps then they would be given a meal ticket worth roughly a dollar. The promise of a free meal convinced all ten, including McGovern, to sign up for the Army Air Corps. McGovern knew he wanted to fly a B-24 [Annotator's Note: Consolidated B-24 Liberator heavy bomber] because he used to watch them land at the airport in Mitchell [Annotator's Note: Mitchell, South Dakota]. In February 1943, McGovern was sent to Jefferson Barracks outside of St. Louis [Annotator's Note: Saint Louis, Missouri]. They went through about 30 days of basic training. They learned how to march, keep their bunks clean, calisthenics, and other useful instruction. McGovern was then sent to the University of Southern Illinois to learn about meteorology, aircraft mechanics, and numerous academic subjects that related to being in the Air Force. They also endured a lot of physical training. Every day they had to run five miles. He remembers lots of sit ups and pull-ups that left him exhausted. McGovern ended up at Kelly Field in San Antonio [Annotator's Note: San Antonio, Texas] for about a month to continue physical training and academic research.

George McGovern had one his buddies took him up in a plane to see if he could still fly a few years ago. He was able to operate the plane; he was even able to land it. It is a testament to the training he went through. McGovern had gone through all types of training then ended up back in Omaha [Annotator's Note: Omaha, Nebraska] and it was there that he picked up his crew. From there he went to Mountain Home, Idaho. They trained for a couple months there learning how to fly together. In Lincoln [Annotator's Note: Lincoln, Nebraska], his wife Eleanor got pregnant. Eventually, McGovern ended up in Virginia at a little base called Patrick Henry. From Norfolk [Annotator's Note: Norfolk, Virginia] they were supposed to fly across the ocean, however, there were not enough planes available so McGovern and his crew were put on a captured German transport ship and spent a month at sea. The convoy was heavily escorted. There were submarines, destroyers, and cruisers escorting McGovern and his men across the Atlantic. He and his crew landed in Naples, Italy. McGovern joined the 743rd Bombardment Squadron, 455th Bombardment Group, 15th Air Force. The commanding officer was General Nathan Twining. As they pulled into Naples Harbor they could see on either side of the docking area several hundred teenagers and young kids. As they got closer to the kids they could hear them demanding candies and chocolate. The officer of the ship came over and forbade the crew to throw anything overboard. A few days before, an American transport ship had come along and began to throw candies overboard, a few dozen kids jumped in the water and a few of them ended up drowning. This was why the Americans did not want to throw treats overboard.

The experience of seeing the kids wanting American candy, and the subsequent revelation of the ship that had passed through earlier, helped George McGovern to understand the problem of hunger. A few nights later he was fast asleep when he heard rustling that woke him up. It turned out a group of young Italian women, most likely mothers, were digging through the trash outside trying to find something to eat for their kids. Everyday, McGovern would see the same group of women selling themselves to make a few extra dollars for their families. It was his first experience with extreme poverty. He has been interested in world hunger ever since he saw those kids. McGovern actually went back to Italy as Ambassador to the UN [Annotator's Note: United Nations] Food and Agricultural program. McGovern, through his dedication toward the problem of world hunger, has helped to feed millions. World War 2 helped to shape his persona in terms of fighting world hunger but immediately following the war McGovern was more focused on learning about history. He lasted nine months in the Seminary as well. He joined the Seminary so that he could spread the word about God and hopefully prevent the world from destroying itself with nuclear weapons. McGovern quickly realized that the Seminary was not for him so he went to Northwestern University's history department. McGovern wrote his dissertation on the Colorado Coal Strike of 1913 and 1914.

George McGovern never really used his doctorate. After he finished, he ended up working for the Democratic party of South Dakota. He became fascinated with starting a grassroots political movement and party, so he never got back to academia. As a result of the progress he saw in the grassroots political movement, McGovern decided to run for election to the House of Representatives. He served four years in the House. With Kennedy [Annotator's Note: President John F. Kennedy], he oversaw the overseas Food for Peace initiatives. Through these initiatives the United States was sending four million pounds of wheat to India alone. McGovern served in the Senate for over 18 years with a brief departure in 1972 to run for President. McGovern picked up his B-24 [Annotator's Note: Consolidated B-24 Liberator heavy bomber] in Italy. The plane had been in combat for some time. Even though he was a pilot, he had to fly his first five missions as copilot with a crew that had combat experience. After those five they could fly their own crew. McGovern flew his first five missions with a man named Howard Serback. Serback was one of the best pilots in the outfit. No one got hit on their first mission together but there was a lot of flack. McGovern's first few missions were among the easiest. His first five missions were against targets in Germany. Since they were flying out of Italy, a lot of the missions were fairly long. Their main objectives were Hitler's [Annotator's Note: German dictator Adolf Hitler] oil refineries. They were amazingly successful raids. Towards the end of the war, the German Air Force was shut down because they did not have oil to run their planes. McGovern flew his last mission the day before the war ended. It was one of his toughest missions because at that point the antiaircraft guns that were spread out to the east and west were now being consolidated to defend Germany. McGovern responds to the idea that the bombing of Germany was over exaggerated by saying that the bombing of oil refineries, while a small part, contributed greatly to the eventual defeat of Germany. In response to critics of the American bombing campaign against Germany McGovern cites Stephen Ambrose as saying, "Could we have won the war without it?" McGovern's final bombing mission was against Linz, Austria, Hitler's hometown. Linz was one of the pooling places for antiaircraft guns. They came back with over 100 holes in the plane. The brakes, flaps, and landing gear were knocked out but only one man was hit, the waist gunner.

When they [Annotator's Note: George McGovern and the men on his aircrew] got back to the field they realized they had no brakes or flaps [Annotator's Note: after a difficult bombing mission over Linz, Austria on 7 May 1945]. They waited until they hit the ground and threw parachutes out of the windows in order to slow down. The runway was about 5,000 feet long. The B-24 [Annotator's Note: Consolidated B-24 Liberator heavy bomber] rolled all the way down the runway and went into a ditch at the end of the runway. They deployed red flares so emergency personnel knew that there was a wounded man on board. McGovern notes that most bombers did not last that long therefore, throughout the duration of his 35 missions, he was constantly switching planes. McGovern loved the B-24. It was a magnificent airplane but it was difficult to fly. There was no hydraulics to assist the pilot in flying it. There were 12,000 B-17s [Annotator's Note: Boeing B-17 Flying Fortress heavy bomber] produced during World War 2 and 18,000 B-24s. The workhorse of the Air Force was the B-24. McGovern recalls being between 23,000 and 26,000 feet when he would drop his bomb loads. He discusses the difficulty of bombing rail lines. He likens it to trying to hit a needle with anything from three blocks away. The odds are not good. The Norden bombsight allowed them to bomb with greater accuracy, however, depending on the wind and other factors the Norden bombsight played a small role in accurate bombing.

The missions George McGovern flew usually required between 4,000 and 6,000 pounds of bombs, with ten of those bombs being 500 pounders. The ratios of bombs to fuel changed depending on the length of the mission. There were also machine guns placed in the tail, nose, ball turret, upper turret, and waist. McGovern saw German fighters but not a lot. Since he entered the war in late summer of 1944 a lot of the German fighters were grounded because of lack of fuel and the practicality of defending a city with antiaircraft guns, that being the fact that antiaircraft guns do not use up fuel. The last mission over Linz [Annotator's Note: Linz, Austria] was the most contested in terms of antiaircraft fire. McGovern also notes that flak above Munich [Annotator's Note: Munich, Germany] was noticeably stronger then over other cities. Over Munich the Germans had set up their antiaircraft guns in a box so that an entire section of sky would be outlined in a box of deadly fire. It made it easier for them to bracket the bombers. Every once in a while McGovern would see a bomber take a flack hit and explode. Maybe a few parachutes would come out, maybe none. One of his navigators volunteered to fill in for another navigator who was sick. The second time he volunteered he was in a plane that was shot down. McGovern never did find out about the navigator. About five years before this interview was done he visited an American cemetery in Italy. There was a "missing in action" section and when McGovern looked through it he saw the name Sam Adams. Adams was the navigator. McGovern read a lot in between missions. When he was at Patrick Henry [Annotator's Note: Camp Patrick Henry in Virginia], the last base he was at, he took a book called The Rise of American Civilization by Charles and Mary Beard. McGovern would read a chapter or two at night lying in his cot. The book was 1,500 pages long and he finished it in no time. He also read Men of the Confederacy. He was fascinated with Stonewall Jackson and Robert E. Lee. He also read War and Peace.

George McGovern also read the Stars and Stripes, the Bible, and various newspapers. He sent home most of what he was paid to his wife. His wife had a baby girl four months before McGovern returned home. She lived with her father at the time. Her father was upset when he returned home because he had fallen in love with the little girl. Eleanor [Annotator's Note: McGovern's wife] was a voracious reader. One time she read an article in Newsweek that showed B-24s [Annotator' Note: Consolidated B-24 Liberator heavy bombers] getting hit and going down over Germany. That scared her. She wrote him letters all the time. He wrote once or twice a week at least. He notes the irregularity of the mail system. Sometimes his wife would get seven letters in a day and then none for weeks. McGovern's father died while he was overseas. He was hunting pheasants. He shot a pheasant and then returned to his buddy's car. Immediately after he got into the car he dropped dead from a heart attack. His father died on 4 December [Annotator's Note: 4 December 1944], but he did not find out until 15 December, a few days after the funeral. The chaplain broke the news to him. He told McGovern that he did not need to fly the next day, however, he wanted to get it over with so he decided to fly. McGovern made it to the island of Capri. He and his copilot got bored on Capri so they decided to fly to Rome.

On their way back to the United States, they [Annotator's Note: George McGovern and his crew] had to make a stop in the Azores to refuel. Their navigator got lost for a little while and it infuriated McGovern to think that he survived 35 combat missions and that he might die in the Atlantic because his navigator could not find the Azores. McGovern radioed the base in the Azores and they ended up finding it. They flew from Naples [Annotator's Note: Naples, Italy] to North Africa to the Azores, then to Newfoundland and finally to Camp Myles Standish in Massachusetts outside of Boston. After that, they rode a train to Minneapolis [Annotator's Note: Minneapolis, Minnesota] and were discharged at Fort Snelling. Before they left Italy, General Twining [Annotator's Note: later USAF General Nathan Farragut Twining] knew that they had supplies to last for months. Food, clothes, mattresses, and just about anything they needed to supply a base were not in short supply. McGovern volunteered to fly the supplies up to Northern Europe. In some cases they were giving food to people who they had been bombing a week before. Another case of a harrowing landing occurred on the Island of Vis in Italy [Annotator's Note: now part of Croatia]. They were down to two engines and had the choice of trying to land on a 2,200 foot runway, or ditch in the Adriatic Sea. The B-24 [Annotator's Note: Consolidated B-24 Liberator heavy bomber] needed 5,000 to land. They landed the B-24 safely and McGovern was awarded the Distinguished Flying Cross. He also had the Air Medal with three oak leaf clusters and other decorations. He notes that the Distinguished Flying Cross was one of the most coveted awards among pilots. When McGovern made the landing on Vis, flak had taken out a lot of their controls yet their brakes were intact. They had about 15 feet to spare on that landing and over the edge of the runway they could see the shells of planes that were not able to stop in time. The plane was crippled to the point that it could not fly. McGovern felt terrible knowing he left 250,000 dollars of taxpayer money lying at the end of that runway.

After George McGovern landed safely on Vis [Annotator's Note: the island of Vis, Croatia], the other nine men in his plane jumped out and kissed the ground. He located a latrine as soon as he landed and when he got inside he realized that out of the 12 people in there, at least four or five were women. No one made a big deal about it. McGovern believes that The National WWII Museum is extremely important because it remembers the last American war that was not disputed. Everyone was together. People believed that the United States should be involved. Hitler [Annotator's Note: German dictator Adolf Hitler] had the capacity to dominate the world militarily. McGovern believes that Stephen Ambrose was the perfect person to spearhead efforts to create The National WWII Museum because of his intense patriotism and belief that America did a great thing in World War 2. Ambrose helped to reinforce McGovern's image as a patriot, especially during the Nixon years when they tried to paint McGovern as antipatriotic. Since McGovern was the focus of Ambrose's book "The Wild Blue" it helped to dispel some of the lies spread about him. McGovern was "really pissed off" when people labeled him unpatriotic. It bothered him to see men who had never even served in the armed forces get up onto the floor of the Senate and clamor on about standing by our soldiers. McGovern says that if they wanted to "stand by their troops then they would bring them home."

It bothers George McGovern today that when he talks to college kids they have no idea about Vietnam. Even though he believed that Vietnam, and even our current conflicts, were not in our national interest, he has great respect and admiration for the soldiers who fought in them. McGovern fought hard for the veterans of Vietnam. When he got back, he was a hero. When the guys got back from Vietnam, they were treated terribly. McGovern felt vindicated when he saw what happened to Nixon and Watergate. He felt confident in his position, even though the country voted for Nixon. He believes that he should have run in 1976 but his wife Eleanor expressed her concerns with being able to stand up to another national campaign.